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Moyie Spring city council minutes, May 2
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July 26, 2012 |
City Council met in special session May 2, 2012,
at the Moyie Springs City Hall.
The meeting was called to order by Mayor Doug
Evans. Present were Councilmen Steve Economu,
Chad Farrens, Terry Johnson and Bart Klaus. Due
to a misunderstanding on the time of the
meeting, City Attorney Dan Featherston was not
at the meeting.
Waived the approval of the minutes of the
regular meeting on April 4, 2012.
The following residents attended the meeting:
Gary Forrester, Gary Mohler, Edna Fry, Rick
Utter, Les Vetter, Lois Vetter, Dale Hire,
Jackie Hire, Tyson Ensz, Les Swanson, Darla
Evans, Douglas Reoch, Clara Miller, Stephanie
Tucker, Tia Avery, Jeff Avery, Ken Carpenter,
Joy Carpenter, Brian Woods, Ron Frederickson,
Kevin Frederickson, Carol Robinson, Sunny
Kimball, Kelley Kimball, Beverly Plato, Carol
Pomeroy, Lila Finley, Valerie Surprenant, Sue
Ackerman, Ken English, Adam Michel, Loren
Michel, Francis Horton, Drexel Love, Claine
Skeen, Steve Oxford, Mike Ashby, Linda Ashby,
Carol Mesenbrink, Jim Ball.
The topic of discussion is Mandatory Garbage
pickup. Mayor Evans said there is garbage on the
sides of the highway from here to town. The
Mennonites picked up garbage last weekend
between the bottom of the Sand Hill and
Roosevelt on Moyie, and I don’t how many garbage
bags there are along the side of the road.
That’s due from everybody from the State Line
this way hauling their garbage in the back of
pickups, so we in Moyie are looking for a change
and we want to see what the people’s opinion is.
Rick Utter said it sounds like a law enforcement
problem to me. If they’ve got garbage blowing
out of their rig that’s littering and an
unsecured load, that’s not the residents of
Moyie’s problem. Jackie Hire said people need to
be more responsible and tie that load down
better. Valarie Surprenant asked if we could
explain better you mean alongside the roads?
Doug said we are looking for household pickup
for garbage like the City of Bonners Ferry.
Valarie asked if Doug meant pickup your yard?
Mayor Evans said no – put a can out for garbage
pickup – household garbage. Gary Mohler said we
can all agree we have a landfill issue, are they
going to do recycling? Or are we going to
compound the problem we already have. Mayor
Evans said we are going to get into that too.
The City of Bonners just took on recycling. Ron
Frederickson explained how it is going to work.
Les Swanson said he was told the city or the
county is putting a manned site east of the
Moyie Bridge. Doug said we have just recently
been told the same thing. Les Swanson said he
thinks that is going to help with the issue
because people from the State Line to the Bridge
are not going to bring garbage. You might get
people from the Sand Hill coming this way, but
he doubts it. Les Swanson said instead of
mandating 650 residents of Moyie to a mandatory
pickup, I think maybe we should look at doing a
mandatory covering your load. Mayor Evans said
it’s not a county law, it’s a State law. Les
Vetter said back to your statement about garbage
in the ditches, I drive to town to work every
single day, and Bonners Ferry has got mandatory
garbage pickup, but when you go down the North
Hill, it’s just like from here to Bonners. Ken
Carpenter said he read the minutes of the last
meeting, and it’s worded to say cities must sign
up for garbage pickup. According to the Statutes
I looked at, cities have the power to do so, but
they are not obligated to do that. Ken said he
thinks this new manned site east of the bridge
will make a big difference. I don’t agree people
should have to spend money they can’t afford to
MAY 2, 2012 (CONT.)
spend. Basically you will have people that are
trashy regardless. Ken said he thinks we have
more of a junk issue around here. Les Swanson
said he thinks the other thing we should be
looking at, is last year my family & I
participated in the city cleanup. Mayor Evans
said wouldn’t it be nice to get this many people
out there? Les Swanson said there was maybe 10
or so people picking up garbage, others picking
up stuff. Les said instead of doing it once a
year, we as a city should do it twice a year.
Les said they collected enough cans that they
were donated to the school. We as a community
should say let’s take care of this issue instead
of the city saying we’re going to mandate you to
pay x amount of money. Mayor Evans said that’s
why we’re having this meeting. Doug Reoch said
he had the garbage truck come to his house, but
he doesn’t want to be told he has to. Mayor
Evans said the council, me especially, am in
favor of it for one reason. I think it would be
a big help in cleaning the City of Moyie up.
Mayor Evans said you drive around and see a
pickup full of garbage because they don’t want
to take it to the dump every week, every month –
it is an issue in Moyie. Rick Utter said if
we’re paying for it, they will have to haul it.
Joy Carpenter said there has been a big influx
of dogs running wild, and I think if we start
putting our garbage out on the street, there
will be more tipped over cans and more garbage
on the roads than there is now. Rick Utter said
Frederickson’s picked up garbage on is road
today, and when he got home the garbage cans
were in the middle of the street and everything
else – that’s kind of a nuisance. Sue Ackerman
said people are always throwing things out the
car window by her house and she picks it up. She
doesn’t want to pay for other people’s garbage.
Valarie Surprenant said there are yards that are
trashy, but there are a lot of who do pick up
their yard. Valarie said it doesn’t seem
reasonable to make people do this. It doesn’t
feel good to be told you have to do this. Is
there any other options besides making people do
this? Mayor Evans said Claine Skeen is here and
he can give us the heads up with the option on
the other side of the bridge. Mayor Evans said
there are more options, it doesn’t have to be
done, it’s entirely up to the council. That’s
why they were wanting to hear input from the
voice of the city which is you guys. That’s why
we put that in the water bill is to get you guys
here. It’s sad that the only this we can get
people here is if we mandate something on them.
Carol Robinson asked if we aren’t already paying
a landfill fee? She was told yes. Mayor Evans
said the City of Bonners gets a cut on that.
Garry Forrester asked how much is it going to
cost? Ron Frederickson said it will be close to
what Bonners is - $8.25 for garbage pickup and
$3.25 for recycling per month. Garry Forrester
asked if the charge would be in the water bill,
or how is it going to be paid? Mayor Evans said
that was the idea we discussed. Rick Utter said
the other issue there is if you’re going to
contract it has to be put out for an open bid.
Mayor Evans said he doesn’t think so. Les
Swanson said if we’re expecting them to pay,
it’s your responsibility as a council to do your
best to find the lowest bidder – there’s more
than Frederickson out there. Les Swanson said if
they are mandated to do this, it’s up to the
council to get the best price. By getting
several bids, it’s going to be competition.
Mayor Evans said he agreed. Mayor Evans said we
haven’t picked anybody or send out any bid
forms. We’re getting the general public involved
right now to find out how you feel. We know how
you feel, it’s pretty obvious. Mayor Evans said
he wishes people had this feel for cleanup day.
Every year there’s a notice put in the water
bills for cleanup day – Mayor Evans said he
takes pride in the city. Valarie Surprenant said
she thought, just by the way it was worded, that
everybody is to pick up their yard. She and her
husband went out and picked up their yard, so
maybe there was a miscommunication. Sunny
Kimball asked if the city has an
ordinance for nuisance property? Mayor Evans
said no. Sunny said maybe they should – mainly
trashy yards. Mayor Evans asked Claine Skeen for
information on the manned site east of the
bridge. Claine Skeen said he’s not here to step
on anybody’s toes. The county has 3 manned sites
around the county plus the landfill. The county
charges a solid waste fee every year. The City
of Bonners residents are about $20.00 lower than
county residents. The people in the City of
Moyie are considered county residents. Claine
said the City of Moyie is a little bit higher
than the City of Bonners Ferry. A couple years
ago the county eliminated all the unmanned sites
throughout Boundary County. Deer Creek was
probably one of the main locations that Moyie
used. There was a lot of illegal dumping there
and that’s the reason we eliminated that site.
Boundary County is under a small community
exemption. We can bury 20T of garbage per day.
Once we exceed that, we lose that exemption.
We’re in the process right now of putting a
monitored site south of the Moyie Bridge where
the State pit is now. Claine said he already has
a permit, and knows what the cost will be to
install power. Right now we are working on the
budget and this site is in my budget for next
year. At that location you will be able to
pretty much throw away everything other than a
dead body or construction demolition debris.
Claine said he can’t guarantee that site is
going to go in, that’s up to the Boundary County
Commissioners, but through his budget, that will
go in if the budget is passed. Mayor Evans asked
Claine if he will know by October 1, 2012?
Claine said he’d probably know sooner than that
– he’d like to have that site up and running
sooner than October. He has one person that is a
fill-in position – he could put him out there
for probably 3 days a week. His budget starts in
October, then it would be 7 days per week. Steve
Economu asked Claine is the manned site would
change our solid waste fee per year? Claine said
he is working on the budget right now and
doesn’t want to raise anybody’s solid waste fee,
and at this time they are close to not raising
the solid waste fee from what you’re paying now.
Steve Economu said if the fees are raised, it
would be County wide? Claine said yes. Steve
asked if the manned site would change what we’re
paying now? Claine said if it does change, it
will change across the table whether it’s Moyie
or Bonners Ferry, or a county resident. Les
Swanson said the City of Bonners Ferry has a
lower solid waste fee than the county. If we’re
mandated by the city to go to this mandatory
pickup, would we be given the same rate as the
City of Bonners Ferry? Brian Woods, attorney for
Frederickson’s came to talk to people so they
would get a little better feel for what’s going
on and maybe help some people understand how it
might benefit the city and the residents of the
city, what it might cost and what it is already
costing you whether you recognize it or not.
Frederickson’s have been doing this work in this
county for 40 years and I think universally
people have a warm and fuzzy feeling about them.
I think they do a very good job and I think the
City of Bonners Ferry would tell you that.
They’re professional, they’re insured, they’re
bonded, they have modern equipment and they have
a track record for doing a good service in this
county. They’re part of our community and they
are second generation working in this local
company. There is a franchise with
Frederickson’s in the City of Moyie, and it’s an
older franchise with Ron’s father. That’s not
what we’re here to talk about. Some of the costs
that you’re already paying, the residents of
this city already pay, whether they think about
it or not, there are already costs that are
being paid. About 60 of the 290 homes in this
city are already persons who are already using
Frederickson’s service, and they’re paying about
$12.00 per month. All those 50 – 60 will see a
dramatic reduction. Drexel Love said they pay
$20.00 per month because they are the only ones
on the road. What about the others who aren’t
– the other 230-240 in the city who aren’t
paying for this service? They are in one of
three groups – they’re either combining
interests in the landfill, making special trips
to the landfill with just garbage or they’re not
hauling at all which seems to be somewhat of a
problem which is why we’re talking about this.
There’s two ways you can figure what it’s
costing those people, you can either just say
it’s costing for the gas, or you can say with
the IRS, if I put a mile on my vehicle, the IRS
says they’re going to reimburse you a mileage
rate. That takes into consideration insurance,
wear and tear on the vehicle and all those other
factors involved in making a trip. If you start
the trip because you’re combining your trip,
going to Bonners to buy groceries, you’re still
going about 2 miles every time you go to the
dump and back it’s a 2 mile round trip. If you
do that, and you do it 2 or 3 times a month,
you’re putting 8.6 miles on your vehicle and you
figure just the gas, you’re going to pay
$2.00-$3.00 per month just for that. If you use
the IRS rate, you’re going to spend $4.77 per
month just for that. You may not realize it, but
you’re paying it. If you make special trips to
the dump, then you’re going to make a 16 mile
round trip every time you go and if you go 3 or
4 times a month, you’re going to be paying
$13.71 just in gas, not considering anything
else if your rig is getting 14 MPG. Use the IRS
rate, taking into consideration all those other
expenses, you’re paying about $26.64 per month
according to the IRS. If the county puts in the
manned site your costs would go down, but my
point is you’re already paying something. The
city does not have to put it out to bid, they
can negotiate with one contractor or they can
negotiate with several contractors. Cities have
big, big reasons to make sure the people they
are contracting to provide service to their
residents are actually capable of doing it and
have a long track record of doing it and are not
sort of fly-by-nights kinds of operations. They
have a long, good standing track record and good
reputation. It is true that they can do that,
it’s just that they’re not required, under Idaho
law to do that. Remember, when we’re talking
about these dollar costs, and going back and
forth to wherever you’re going, you’re ignoring
a lot of other costs and I want to make sure you
guys understand all these. You’re ignoring the
time you’re spending doing this, the wear and
tear on you vehicle, spills in the truck, and
garbage spills out of the truck. There’s the
risk of injury of loading the garbage into the
truck and out of the truck at the landfill,
weather issues in the winter – all of these are
avoided when you go to a curbside collection
system. You also have damages, in the form of
losses, and the loss of your cans – they blow
out the back to or from the landfill, lids get
lost, and then, of course, you have the mud at
the landfill. There are a lot of nonmonetary
convenience factors that are also supportive of
a curbside collection system. In addition to
saving you money there’s a lot of other
significant benefits to the city. I’m not making
this up, this is real stuff. What of community
beautification? If you’re a single mother, and
you’ve got two little kids running around, and
you don’t have good transportation, and you’re
living at the poverty line, and the big wheel
breaks. You’ve got to get that out of your yard
or it’s going to sit there and the grass is
going to grow around it and it’s not going to
make the place look very nice. It’s a major
problem for you, if you’re living close to the
line, to make that happen. If you’re getting a
weekly service, it comes by, you’re naturally
going to be able to take advantage of that a lot
easier than getting it to the landfill or some
other site. You’re going to have a lot prettier
community. You’re going to help the 50 – 60
people already on the service because if you
just go garbage, their rates are probably going
to go down, and they’ll probably like that, so
there are 50 – 60 people who would be in favor
of it for that reason. You’d have less pollution
on the way to town, less vehicle traffic on the
road and you’re going to help economic
development.
Economic development comes in two forms –
businesses moving in or residents moving in, and
the reality is the baby boomers are retiring and
they’re relocating from higher costs, higher tax
states. You guys think $8.50 is a lot – I’m a
Kansas guy, I tend to think anti, you know,
sorta not bigger government kind of stuff too.
The reality is we live pretty cheaply in these
parts – a lot cheaper than people in other
states live, and they’re looking for lower cost
states to move to. Moyie has the ability because
of the geographic beauty of attracting those
people. If you get a better looking community,
it helps in that, and it helps retain the people
that are already there. Les Swanson said he
understands the benefits. He’s lived in his home
for 5 years. Not once, if these are all the good
benefits, not once has Frederickson ever put a
flyer, never called my home, knocked on my door
to offer their services to me. Only now are they
saying, they go through our city council or our
city council contacted them, I’m not sure which
it is, and then we’re being told you’ve got to
do it and these are all the good benefits. If
they wanted to do economics, shouldn’t they have
been out drumming up business for themselves?
Instead of 30 maybe they could have had 80 or 90
people out here in Moyie. Not once in the 5
years I’ve lived here have I ever been contacted
by Fredericksons. Brian Woods said that may be
and I don’t have answers to that. I know that
Ron & Kevin and his family are really busy. Ron
Frederickson said it’s more of a privacy issue.
Mayor Evans said from my talk with him, he
doesn’t want to step on anybody’s toes, and
that’s where he’s coming from. Les Swanson said
we should be supporting him – if he wants our
business, maybe he should drum it up instead of
mandating it. Brian Woods said that’s a fair
point and I think that’s what the council will
ultimately decide what direction they want to
go. I’m just trying to point out some of the
benefits to the folks in the city and to the
city itself of possibly looking seriously at it
– it is a positive, at the end of the day, of
doing it. Could Ron and his family have done
better in business development previously, well
sure, but that’s also just not – he doesn’t like
being in people’s faces and forcing things.
Steve Oxford said they recycle their garbage, is
that something they’re going to do? Brian Woods
said absolutely – they’re willing to do any
level of service that the city feels is
appropriate. They’re prepared to do whatever.
Steve Oxford said he lives in the city limits,
the city doesn’t plow their street because it’s
private, so how are they going to get in and out
of their road? Brian Woods said that’s one of
the reasons why the cost structure needs to be
pretty close to Bonners because Bonners does do
a better job of clearing their streets, they do
a better job of maintaining streets, there’s
more density in the pick ups. In other words,
they stop every 50 – 100 ft. instead of every
mile or 300 yds. That’s why he wants to be
competitive and help the City of Moyie, but
really, probably from a cost perspective,
there’s probably the same or greater cost of
providing the service here than in the City of
Bonners. Gary Mohler said he can see some of the
benefit. One of the benefits would be if they
slowed their trucks down. Gary said he’s called
in twice and left messages complaining about
their drivers and never got a response. They
come flying through my neighborhood. You can see
where they make the corner, they roll the rocks
from the tandems. Brian Woods said that’s a good
point and if the city did decide to do this, and
that’s up to the city to decide, the city would
enter into a contract, presumably with the
provider, and the city can say just that. The
city can say not only that, but other things
that need to be said like: you have to have
certain liability insurance, you need to have
certain kind of equipment, your people need to
be bonded, all those regulatory things that need
to be a part of this, should be a part of it and
that can be one of them. Brian Woods said as a
lawyer guy he doesn’t like hearing that either.
Gary Mohler said he can tell every garbage day
because they come up Elk and turn over to
Westwood and they cut the corner. Sooner or
later someone is going to be coming up there and
they’re going to catch them head on. Les Vetter
said he’s lived in Moyie Springs his whole life.
Les said he had Frederickson’s haul his garbage
and they did an outstanding job for him. Les
said he chose to hire him to come and pick up
his garbage. He had no complaints about their
service, ever. All the things aside you said
about wear & tear on your vehicle, I work for
the county so I know how you get paid for your
mileage and how that works. Les said now he
chose to haul his own garbage. He keeps his
house up. His stuff doesn’t fly out of his
pickup. He chooses to do that on his own. This
is about mandating to us to give Frederickson’s
our work when he can do it himself, and he chose
not to have them do his work anymore. Brian
Woods said Les is right, and that’s a
philosophical perspect, in other words people
are going to have disagreements over what the
right philosophical result is. Most larger
cities don’t give you a choice, they’re not
going to give you that option. I’m sure that’s
why you choose to live in a smaller community
because right now you have that option to either
have the service or not. Most cities will tell
you that they don’t let their residents decide
you’re not going to have the service. From a
health and sanitation and beautification and a
safety perspective, and the black plague in the
middle ages, that was because of the failure of
sanitation, failure of garbage service. I’m not
suggesting that’s a problem, but I am suggesting
that has been a huge problem. That’s why every,
of any size, that I’m aware of, in this country,
requires all residents, who are in the city, to
subscribe to some sore of garbage service. While
you’re going a great job, but the neighbor
across the street isn’t, and then your home
value suffers from that, you smell it, you have
to look at it, you have to deal with it from a
nuisance perspective. Even though your house is
looking great, the guy across the street
couldn’t care less and is not being responsible.
Les Vetter said he works for the Boundary County
Assessors Office and has for 15 years. Bonners
Ferry is part of his revaluation cycle – every 5
years he does the South Hill – he knocks on
every single door on the South Hill every five
years. Bonners has mandatory garbage pickup and
when he goes around the neighborhoods in Bonners
Ferry, even though they have mandatory garbage
pickup, you’re going to find the same pigsty
houses with the same pickups full of garbage in
the back of them, just the same as they are
right now, and they have mandatory garbage
pickup. Brian Woods said you will never fix 100%
of the problem until a city gets and chooses to
enforce other regulatory things. Cities pass all
sorts of things and then cities have to decide
are we going to enforce those things that are on
our books. Cities have all kinds of regulatory
police power authority. Having them on the books
and enforcing them are sometimes two entirely
different things, and I don’t think the City of
Moyie, correct me if I’m wrong, have any of
those regulations. Ken Carpenter said he doesn’t
want Moyie Springs to be a little Bonners Ferry.
We are Moyie Springs – just because Bonners
Ferry does something, whether it works for them
or not – it obviously doesn’t – there are places
that are junky, and there’s always going to be
some of that here. We shouldn’t be penalized for
all the people around Moyie that are getting
this stuff flowing into the ditches, and some of
them even come through Moyie. So don’t try to
turn us into little Bonners Ferry – we’re Moyie
Springs and proud of it. Most of us take pretty
darn good care of our place, and if there’s a
problem, then maybe certain people should be let
known to get their stuff together and start
doing something. Jeff Avery said you’re not
going to be able to regulate people into being
better citizens. They’re going to choose to or
not to and passing more laws to regulate their
lives is not going to solve the problem. Brian
Woods said at one level he agrees and another
level he doesn’t. Mayor Evans said Brian Woods
is not with the city, he is with Fredericksons.
Brian Woods said he is just trying to
facilitate, to give people different ideas. The
City of Bonners Ferry does get a break on their
solid waste fees. The City of Moyie, if they
decide to do this, can certainly say we’d like
to negotiate with the county. Brian said with
the changing demographics, in this part of the
world, and the higher density levels we’re going
to see, as the city decides whether to expand
its borders to encompass more property, he
thinks expectations will be higher for the
people that are moving in, maybe your response
is they shouldn’t move in then, but the
expectation levels are higher, and the level of
service is a pretty high level of service for a
reasonable cost. Edna Fry said why should she
want to pay for mandatory anything? She takes
her garbage in 4 time a year. Edna said she
doesn’t make garbage, she recycles. Edna said
she doesn’t want a monthly bill because she
takes her garbage only 4 times a year – and her
car gets 27 MPG. Rick Utter the sales pitch is
great and they do provide an excellent service
for the people that want it. Rick said he hasn’t
ever heard complaints about them. Rick said he
has followed their truck to the landfill, from
Moyie, and has seen garbage blowing out. That
could happen with anybody’s rig, but you’re
asking us to pay a fee for something not all of
us need. Those who need it or want it are
welcome to hire them. Rick said he has 2 bags of
garbage per month because he recycles and sorts.
Why should he pay a monthly fee for 2 bags of
garbage when he goes to town to buy groceries –
yes, it’s 2 miles into the landfill but that’s
still less than that monthly fee is going to
cost him. Brian Woods said on the whole, I don’t
use it so I don’t want to pay it. Every city and
county and any governmental agency always faces
arguments just like that based on those kinds of
factors. Brian said personally he doesn’t drive
to Canada but twice a year. He doesn’t always
drive on those roads, but he still has to pay
for them. Lila Finley said that’s what they’re
saying – they have to pay for all of that and
they don’t want another thing they have to pay
for. Brian Woods said that’s for this group and
this group to figure out. Claine Skeen said with
that solid waste fee we pay to the county, you
can come in and dispose of anything at that one
solid waste fee per year – 350 days a year. Rick
Utter said his question, as a citizen of Moyie,
does that fee include also wood debris, metal
debris, etc., or is that going to be another
additional cost, above and beyond the existing
cost of garbage and recycled material. You’re
still going to have to haul your wood debris,
your metal debris, etc. Rick Utter said here
again, he’s heard it before, either you can
provide the service, Bonners Ferry Garbage will
provide that service, at an additional cost or
are you going to be in the same boat you’re in
tonight and haul it to the landfill? Brian Woods
said he will respond to that on several levels.
One – you can put garbage and wood in your
receptacle and it will be hauled to the
landfill, but then, what happens is the county
pushes back, and Claine knows this like
everybody else, the county pushes back and says
to the City of Bonners Ferry, well that’s
contributing towards our 20 ton so please don’t
put it in with your garbage. That’s a county
request that you not put your lawn cuttings and
wood, etc. in with the regular garbage. You
recycle that or do something else with that –
that’s coming from the county. That wouldn’t
necessarily be coming from the City of Moyie.
Fredericksons for years and years, since 1968
picked up yard waste every year in the City of
Bonners Ferry without a complaint or additional
cost. They did that and would have continued to
do that, and then the county talked to the City
of Bonners Ferry and said they didn’t think that
was such a good idea anymore because they were
pushing up against the 20 ton limit per day. If
there’s a regulatory prohibition on that, that
would probably be coming from the county
commissioners to the City of Moyie.
Frederickson’s would be willing to do it and I’m
sure the City of Moyie would be willing to do
it, the questions is whether or not the county
would permit it. Rick Utter said if you take it
to the landfill, your have to separate it. Brian
Woods said that’s when you take it. Rick Utter
said if they pick it up it should be separated.
Brian Woods said no, the answer is no.
Rick Utter said then why should we pay for a
service that doesn’t help us? Brian Woods said
it does. Right now the City of Moyie can say you
can put your grass clippings and everything else
in with the garbage. Rick Utter said then they
would be filling up the landfill and that’s not
the idea. Mayor Evans said we’ve discussed that,
we’re kind of getting the hint about what
everybody here in the room wants. Is there
anybody else that has anything else to add? Doug
Reoch said he thinks the issue about the yard
clippings – there’s things you can’t leave by
your garbage cans for Fredericksons to haul.
Partly, they don’t have time, partly some of it
is too much for them to move. Sometimes you can
load up a pickup to haul to the landfill and you
have 3 guys helping you. Mayor Evans said he
entirely understands what Claine is saying. In
Claine’s aspect he looking at a 20 ton limit and
Fredericksons will haul it if you put it in 2
cans you will haul it, right? Ron Frederickson
said yes, if it’s under 60 lbs. and it’s 3 cans.
Rick Utter asked Claine Skeen wood and grass
clippings don’t count as part of the 20 tons per
day, right because they are recycled and sent
out? Claine Skeen said right. Mayor Evans said
when you go to the dump, if Fredericksons go to
the dump, if that counted? Claine Skeen said
whatever is in the truck goes in the landfill.
Ken Carpenter said which means eventually we all
pay a bunch more when that landfill gets full.
Sue Ackerman said doesn’t it bother you that
those who have garbage service don’t recycle at
all? Mayor Evans said he thinks that’s why
Bonners Ferry went to the recycling program.
Claine Skeen said the recycling program is a
voluntary program. We all need to look in this
room, he doesn’t want to be a garbage cop. At
the same turn around, this community, twenty
years ago, got that small community exemption.
You’re paying $100, $98 if you live in the City
of Bonners Ferry. He’s sure Ron has done
numbers, he’s done numbers – it will double, if
not triple your solid waste fee once we start
shipping this out of Boundary County. Claine
Skeen said he’s not picking on anybody here, but
whatever happens will affect Boundary County.
Mayor Evans said if the dump ever closes down,
it’s going to take, at present time what’s it
going to take, Claine? Claine Skeen said $1.8
million. Mayor Evans asked how much the county
has? Claine Skeen said $800,000 plus. Mayor
Evans said if that’s 10 years from now, that
will probably be 3 times that much, right? Ken
English asked Claine if he happens to know what
it costs Bonners County to haul to their
landfill? Claine Skeen said $45.00/ton 2 years
ago. Mayor Evans said so that’s if the landfill
ever closes down, we’ll have to pay to haul it
off? Claine Skeen said we can either transfer it
out or go into a lined landfill. Claine Skeen
said the reason he’s here is the recycling
program is a voluntary program. Bonners Ferry
Garbage has been an excellent company, we work
very well together as a county and a private
hauler. Claine said his job is to make sure this
landfill stays open as long as possible,
whatever needs to be done, needs to be done.
Mayor Evans asked if the council had any
questions for anybody? Does the crowd have
anymore? Francis Horton asked Mayor Evans if he
could repeat why he supports this? Mayor Evans
said because he thinks it would make the city a
lot cleaner. Valarie Surprenant said she can’t
help but wonder, the majority of them keep their
yard clean, pick up our trash and haul it. Would
mandating this actually make the people who have
trash in their yards and are not keeping up
their yards, is it really going to make those
people say – hey, let’s pick up our yard today?
They haven’t for the last year and a half –
let’s do it because we have garbage cans. Jimmy
Ball said the way the county or the City of
Bonners currently bills, they’re billing the
landowners on the water bills, and they’re going
to add the garbage onto the water bills. Jimmy
said he probably has 40 water bills in the City
of Moyie. That’s how many houses he will be
responsible for paying the garbage on. Every
other municipality, in the county, including the
City of Bonners Ferry, the tenants get the bills
directly. If the landlords get the bills, the
tenants are the problem, as far as picking up
their yards, he doesn’t see how that’s going to
make the tenants do anything when he is the one
getting the bills and paying it regardless of
their responsibility level. Mayor Evans told
Jimmy that would be up to him to enforce. Jimmy
Ball said that’s the truth, and that would
be…..what he’s going to do is just check how
that all works, how he gets forwarded all those
bills. Jimmy said he doesn’t have the time or
money to enforce something like that. He said
he’ll be forced to pay the bill, but he’s not
going to go out and give people garbage cans and
tell people to put their garbage out. If he was
going to do that, he would just go out there and
do that then he would get the money and he would
haul the garbage to the dump – then he would get
paid. Brian Woods said he would like to make one
additional point, if the city decides to do a
mandatory service, they can put in place
whatever other regulatory requirements or
ordinance. In fact, we’ve talked about, and
already provided, a draft of an ordinance for
their consideration. You can add to that
whatever regulatory things you would want to
have. The city would have the ability to send
that notice out to a resident to say your yard
needs to be cleaned up by such and such a date.
Since they have the service and are already
paying for the garbage service, whether or not
they’re using it, to that point or not, the city
would additional regulatory tools to send an
easy letter out and say to that resident you
either do this by this date, or either the city
will come by and pick up your yard for you, and
send you an even bigger bill, or we’ll fine you.
Cities and do, and do do, all kinds of things to
get compliance with what they want to see to
beautify the community. For those people who are
already taking good care of their yard, great.
Ken Carpenter said the city can do this without
mandating our garbage pickup. Brian Woods said
Ken is exactly right, the city can do that too.
Francis Horner said why don’t we do that first
before implementing this big city wide project?
Jimmy Ball said if they do that, that’s an
overall burden, just like animal control –
they’re taking on the burden of enforcement at
that point. Brian Woods said that’s right, and
then the question becomes a balancing act
between the property owners who are taking care
of their property and see their property values
diminish, and their ability to sell and their
ability to take pride in their community
diminished because of the unsightly ones. Jimmy
Ball said all of his houses are currently
rented, brought in revenue, I’m paying more and
more water bills all the time, all of my houses
are tax paying – this community is growing. It’s
growing in a good way, all his stuff he tries to
keep hammered out and he works well with the
city. Brian Woods said your point is exactly the
point I want to make. Jimmy Ball said if there
needs to be enforcement it doesn’t need to
mandatory, he can simply take requests and he’ll
go out there and handle his tenants. Valarie
Surprenant asked if that’s something they can do
– the city going out and requesting the people
clean up their yard? That’s something that can
be cone now? Mayor Evans said we can draft more
ordinances, just like this one. Valarie
Surprenant asked if it would be something that
would have to be drafted, it’s not in place
right now? Carol Robinson if the city passes a
clean up ordinance the city would have to hire
somebody else to enforce it because Sandy, Ken
and John don’t have time to do that. Mayor Evans
said that’s exactly true. Carol Robinson said
we’d have another employee, another set of
insurance, another withholding, the whole
business. Mayor Evans said bigger
burdens. Carol Robinson said we need to police
ourselves, and talk to your neighbor if you
don’t like the way his yard looks and offer to
help them. In her neighborhood that would work
because they do work together. Why don’t you try
to get a block party – that sort of thing. Mayor
Evans said we’ve had one for the last five
years. Jimmy Ball said the person on Division
St., the guy that has the stuff all over his
yard, the worst looking house in Moyie Springs,
bar none. That guy is not going to change
anything, the junk cars out in back, the
campers, a mobile home that’s falling in half
back there. This thing is not what Moyie needs.
If anything we need more employees to enforce
the law that probably already exists in an
ordinance. Jimmy said he would work with the
city – he owns a ton of houses here. He told the
council if they give him orders he will follow
them to the tee because he appreciates us. He
doesn’t need to be forced to pay thousands of
dollars – it is a burden to him to have an
expanded government. He can barely afford to
stay in business as it is. Mayor Evans asked if
there are any more comments? Joy Carpenter said
many of those here tonight do recycle and take
care of their yards. She has nothing against
Frederickson’s – they picked up her garbage at
one time and it wasn’t their problem that she
couldn’t remember it was Wednesday. She thinks
mandating it, Ken will still have to take it to
the dump because she can’t remember it’s
Wednesday, and then as far as recycling, there’s
an extra charge. Mayor Evans asked if there are
anymore comments? Hearing none, we can call this
meeting concluded and he appreciates everybody
coming. He would like everybody to know there is
a cleanup day notice in your water bill every
year, and we’d enjoy seeing this many people
come to cook hamburgers and hot dogs when we get
done working. We’ve cleaned up about 100 cars,
in the last five years, in the City of Moyie.
Sunny Kimball asked when the decision on
mandatory garbage pickup will be made? Mayor
Evans said at the next regular meeting, next
week – May 9th . Tyson Ensz asked if this comes
up for a bid, can he be notified? Mayor Evans
said yes. Mr. Ensz was told if you work for a
government entity, you have to be insured. A
motion was made by Steve Economu and seconded by
Bart Klaus to adjourn. Motion carried.
/s/
Attest: City Clerk |
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